Tod Seelie finds selfishness to be offensive

Name: Tod Seelie
Age: 32
Hometown: Cleveland, OH
Job description: Photographer
Upcoming projects: Konbit Shelter Project in Haiti with Swoon, undisclosed project in Chernobyl, Empire Drive-In at SJ Biennial with Jeff Stark and Todd Chandler.

Select links: Sucka Pants, Tod Seelie Photography, Everyday I Live, Of Quiet

Describe your current state of mind.

Focused and harried. Focused because it’s the week and that’s the only way I get anything done. And harried because I just recently found out that I’ll be leaving for Haiti very shortly, and of course, there are 50 million things I have to do before that. So it’s in that final countdown phase and I’m just trying to juggle everything and get some major hurdles out of the way.

What’s your idea of happiness?

Free key lime pie.

What’s your greatest fear?

Death. That’s an easy question.

Is there a certain kind of death that you’re afraid of?

No. More of what comes after death.

Do you believe in an afterlife?

I’d like to. I don’t know if I can. And that’s the scary part.

If you didn’t live in New York, where would you live?

I think about that one all the time. Part of me definitely thinks I would go to the West Coast. But that’s in the I’m-done-with-New York-let’s-go-somewhere-else. I feel like Los Angeles or San Francisco would have enough of what I enjoy and would be completely different at the same time. But then there’s a part of me that would like to get a little house in the woods in Upstate New York. I really like the Hudson Valley but growing up I also spent a lot of time in the Southwest corner so I like it over there. Those are two extremes. Or the Pacific Northwest; I just love the nature of the foggy pine forests. That is a beautiful area. I don’t know which is more realistic. I’m not planning on moving any time soon, maybe in the sort of near future, but I definitely don’t think I’m done with cities yet. That factors into it greatly.

What’s offensive to you?

Selfishness.

What’s fun?

Exploring.

What’s one thing – tangible or intangible – that you couldn’t live without?

The freedom to move wherever I’d want to. Basically the opposite of jail.

Is there a scene in New York that you think should die?

There’s a universal linking characteristic between things in New York that I really dislike. And it’s not exclusive to one scene at all. In fact it’s part of every scene. So it’s more of an aspect of scenes that I think should die, which is selfishness. There’s a pattern here, a theme running throughout things.

And do you think selfishness pertains to narcissism and snobbery?

I think narcissism comes from selfishness and vanity. I think those are hugely unhealthy and destructive elements in general. You see those characteristics more in other scenes that are not yours. But I’m also not going to pretend that it’s exclusive to any one scene either.

New York is full of people who are driven to succeed. Have you ever found yourself grappling with selfishness yourself coming up as an artist in New York?

I would say, No, because I’ve had limited opportunities to be in a position of power. I’ve also pursued collective projects because of the cooperation aspects. I definitely think that you tend to benefit more from supporting each other than you do from stepping on each other. I come from a very specific place in the way my mind works, and it just doesn’t work well with that sort of [selfish] element. At the same time I’ve had situations where you pour yourself into a group thing and someone kind of hijacks it for [him or herself]. That definitely happens but I just think that’s an element that’s part of the landscape. You need to get to know people for who they are and treat them accordingly. You can work with a huge variety of people and personalities if you are realistic in your relationships with them. And I think that’s the key for dealing with [selfishness] in New York.

What do you think is overrated?

Wealth equaling worthwhile-ness.

And underrated?

Hard work.

What’s the most difficult thing that you’ve ever had to do?

This is maybe not the most interesting answer but it’s the most obvious. At one point in my life I had to talk my way out of being kidnapped at gunpoint by drug dealers in Brazil. And I didn’t speak Portuguese.

How did you do that?

With Spanish.

What were you doing in Brazil?

I was visiting a friend of mine. And when I got kidnapped I was out taking photographs at night.

How many people kidnapped you?

Only one person kidnapped me on the street but they took me to the roof of their stronghold. I think there were seven other guys. They were young scrawny kids but they had machine guns.

There are a lot of words that are very similar and on occasion there are words that are not similar so you kind of stumble through it. I remember the word for “key” I could not figure out for the life of me. They questioned me for quite a while and eventually let me go; I was really lucky.

Do your parents understand your occupation? What would they say about what you do?

Yeah, for the most part. My parents have very different views about what I do. In my mother’s case it’s like, “I support you. You’re a good kid. No worries.” My dad has sort of the opposite response. [He] had nothing to with me for a long time, thought I was wasting my life and has since sort of come around. I wouldn’t say he fully understands and appreciates, but he’d say sort of a similar thing, “Eh. You’re a good kid. You’re okay not making any money and doing this art thing, but whatever.”

What’s one thing that few people know about you?

I know how to sail.

How did you learn how to sail?

I grew up on Lake Erie.

You’ve biked in countries abroad. Do you have any tips for embarking on an international bike tour?

It’s not a race.

Do you have any good habits?

My good habits are nerdy things like always brushing my teeth every night. Then I don’t have to drop $500 on a dentist; it’s worth it in my book. Traveling on crazy adventures and sleeping on the ground I actually always brush my teeth.

And bad habits?

I’m really bad at introducing people.

Do you get in trouble for that?

Yeah, all the time.

How do you put your subjects at ease?

I just try to talk to them and make jokes about myself or whatever’s going on to kind of distract them from the fact that a camera’s aimed at them. But I never try to pretend that it’s not happening. Silence can kind of get to people, just staring at them and them just staring at you. I also have a lot of luck where I don’t tend to shoot complete strangers all that often; most of the people I shoot are friends of mine or maybe we know each other on some level. So I’m sort of given a break there already; it’s not some celebrity and I’ve got 20 minutes. That would be tough.

Some of your photographs contain girls flashing their breasts, for example. I know you don’t pose your subjects but how much art direction was involved with those kind of photos?

Typically the only instruction I give them is stand there and look at me. So there is a very basic instruction but it’s because I keep them stylistically the same. Other portraits, like the ones you mentioned, are more casual and spontaneous. Something’s happening and I’m saying, “Freeze, just hold that.” And so they do have to freeze because most of the time I don’t have my camera aimed at them; it might take a couple seconds and I have to run across the room and grab [my camera]. But it’s one of those things where you’re seeing something happening and you’re thinking, That’s amazing. And you just say, “Hold that.” I wouldn’t call that direction. I would call that pausing reality.

What do you shoot with?

I shoot both film and digital. I shoot with a medium-format Hasselblad, which are the square-format images. And then I shoot with a Canon 5D [with] a couple of different lenses and a flash.

What advice would you give to aspiring photographers?

Just shoot all the time and look at what you shoot to learn how to translate what you see in real life, how the camera interprets it, and how you end up with this result versus another result. That’s really the only way to learn how to shoot. And the other thing to do is look at as much photography as you can. With the internet now it’s ridiculous [how many] sources there are just to prowl through. I used to go to the one bookstore where I lived and I digested their whole photo section in like two days. I used to go to museums and only go to the bookstore. Look at all the photography that you can but don’t just look through it. Figure out if you like it or dislike it and figure out why. And in doing that you’ll really be educating yourself about your own personal vision and aesthetics. And I think that’s really key.

What’s the best and worst thing about being a photographer?

The thing about being a photographer is that whether it’s your job or your way of making art it’s directly connected to your experiences in real life. You cannot create your work in a vacuum. A painter can sit and create a painting from absolutely nothingness in a studio. A photographer can’t. I mean even if you’re a studio shooter you are still bringing an element from the real world to photograph. I don’t know if it’s the best or the worst but it’s probably both.

Okay, good answer. What’s your fondest memory from The Swimming Cities of Serenissima?

There was a moment near the end of the trip where we stormed the grand canal of Venice on the rafts at like 4 in the morning because we could not get permission through any channel. We tried for weeks to get permission [but] waterways in Venice are restricted to native Venetians only. And we were not only non-native Venetians but we weren’t even Italian, and we tried and tried to get them to make an exception for the Venice Biennale. We weren’t a part of the Biennale anyway so that didn’t really work, but it wasn’t happening.

So we were like, "Fuck it. We may go to jail but…” We loaded up the rafts and people were told that, "If you come with us you may be spending some time in a Venetian jail, just so you know." And some people were like, "Yeah I’m not going to do that." But a crew of us went down the canal in the dark with this band, Dark Dark Dark, performing on the top deck of one of the boats. So their sort of already spooky music was echoing off these ancient buildings with not a soul in sight. As we came back out of the canal, the gray dawn was lifting and it was the most beautiful thing that I have seen in my entire life - hands down.

Do you know anyone who was sent to Venetian jail?

We had a couple of crew members spend some time there. Apparently it wasn’t as bad as a New York jail, but Italian cops aren’t very nice either.

As a photographer how do you balance the line between exploitative and putting your subject on a pedestal?
 
That’s something I’ve thought about from when I first started taking photos. It’s a tricky line that I think everyone has to figure out for themselves. I definitely see photographers whose work is very exploitative but often times I feel it’s exploitative not because they’re malicious but because they’re clueless or, dare I say, selfish. It’s not thinking of their subject or how it affects them. 

I also find that a lot of times for me there are two decisions. There’s the decision to take the photo at all and then there’s the decision in how I’m going to share the photo and how it’s presented. Because you can’t control an image once it’s out there. You can't control how people interpret images which on the one hand I find really interesting; your subjects can also get involved in that because it’s their image. 

I feel like I’ve tuned in my personal radar to a certain degree where I trust my instincts. It’s also hard because what I’m okay with maybe not everyone else is. I mean there’s definitely a lot of photographs where the person’s naked and I talk to the model about it, “Hey I’m thinking about putting it in the show and I’m involved in this. What do you think?” Some people say “Yes” and some people say “No” but it’s the discussion that matters. The fact that you asked is great enough. Some people see it as, It’s my photo. I got it and that’s all there is to it. But I don’t feel like that’s a responsible way to live your life.

Have there been any moments where you’ve hesitated to shoot?

The one moment that I’m consistently hesitant is when someone’s injured. This happens mostly at Bike Kill-type events. I’m very careful there. Often times I’ve seen gnarly injuries and the person didn’t go to the hospital. Their face was fucked up and I don’t take a photo because I don’t really want to promote that. That’s my friend, they’re in a lot of pain, and they look terrible.

There was one instance I remember when I was younger. I was traveling and there was a motorcycle accident right in front of me. The rider on the motorcycle just flew off his bike, slid on the pavement and then slid under a parked car. So only like half of his body was sticking out and half of his torso was under the car…

And it was the most amazing photo moment but I was just so worried for the guy that I didn’t even think to take the photo. It just popped in my mind as I was trying to see if the guy was okay.

Do you have any tips on how to photograph within a crowd without getting kicked in the face? 

Yeah, don’t go in the crowd. I’ve been shooting concerts for a really long time and there are definitely different approaches and styles. Different people stay in the photo pit and backstage and you get those photos. I’m not interested in those photos.

The photo pit’s great when they have them. But it’s rare that I’m at a show that has a photo pit. You have to put yourself where you need to be to get the shot. Half the skill of photography is being in the right place at the right time, with the right equipment to do the job. So yeah I’m going to go where I’m going to get kicked in the head, because otherwise I’m not going to shoot; either do the best job you can or don’t bother.

And at the same time I feel like a bigger problem, with the explosion of people shooting concerts, is this idea that the concert’s happening exclusively for you to capture and your photos matter more than the crowd of 500 people behind you. I’ve gotten into arguments with photographers because I’ve been just like, “You’re being an ass. Cut that out. Be more discrete.” And I guess I feel like I can say something to them because I’m shooting with them and therefore they might listen to me.

There have been a couple of instances where people have been like, “Yeah, you’re right.” But most of the time they just yell back; I think it’s selfish. Don’t stand in front of a band with your camera over your head for the whole freakin’ show and be shooting random photos. Just because you have a photo pass and you can get in front of the audience does not mean that they don’t matter. And sometimes you have to stick your camera up for a second to get one shot, but make it one shot. I guess it comes from being an audience member for a long time before I started taking photos. But the show’s not happening for you, it’s happening for the audience, and you need to respect that.